Why doesn't Disco Stu like 1Ls?
DS was recently in the library surrounded by 1Ls. At first it was just one or two, but inevitably more flowed in (they still haven’t figured out that grades are mostly arbitrary and they really shouldn’t care about law school – and DS was only there because he had to make up work from an extended Tahoe vacation). They started jabbering about WOA – it’s a one credit class people! They were chomping their gum and sniffling their noses and playing with their highlighters. They were texting their friends (probably about some mundane thing like myspace). And DS realized, he really didn't like 1Ls. Maybe he realized it a long time ago and was just trying to procrastinate from writing a paper. The following are some of the possible explanations.
Does DS dislike anyone new? He generally doesn't have a problem with transfers – although he thinks they should all stop congregating around the same tables at the entrance. And he didn’t like how during OCIP they took a lot of firm jobs away from fellow Boalties who were smart (or lucky) enough to get in the first time and have actually been going here a full year and a half – although he has no doubt they have a stronger work ethic than he does and will probably do better for a firm b/c they busted their ass at their previous (pathetic) law school in order to graduate with a Boalt JD.
Is DS jealous? He thinks on average 1Ls are a better-looking class. Perhaps a bit cooler too. There are some fun ones out there. Those who show up for bar review, or routinely get joked in Boalt Briefs and don’t complain about it. DS doesn’t think this is it though. He’s ready to be done with law school – after all, he’s phoning it in right now. DS certainly doesn’t wish he were a 1L, no matter how good they look.
Is DS just an asshole? (Remember though, he posted the 1L guide to OCIP and tried to pass down the lessons he and others had learned). Does this mean that he feels sorry for them in addition to loathing them?
Is DS just too old? Today’s music sucks. He generally doesn’t try to associate with anyone born in the 80s – though exceptions are made. To quote from Abe Simpson – “I used to be with it. Then what it was changed. And what I was with wasn’t it. And what was it was weird and scary.”
As a 3L will he dislike both 2Ls and 1Ls? Will he simply dislike the same rising 2Ls and not the new 1Ls?
As a 2L has DS not earned the right to think he’s better than 1Ls? As an upperclassmen in college he can’t remember disliking freshmen. He certainly thought they were less human, and treated them accordingly.
Is it the way they’re still interested in class? They answer all the prof’s questions. They still seem excited to be there. Does DS want to feel that way again?
Do all 2Ls feel like this (not just our class, but 2Ls in perpetuity)? Will this year’s 1Ls dislike next year’s 1Ls? Do other law school 2Ls dislike other law school 1Ls?
DS would be interested to see how other 2Ls feel toward our junior class. And how did last year’s 2Ls feel toward us?
A caveat. DS does not prescribe to Armen's notion that he will stand by everything he has written. DS is anonymous for a reason - this post. Transfers will get upset at this. 1Ls will get upset at this. DS is simply saying what many 2Ls are thinking. A frank discussion needs to be had about interclass dynamics and DS hopes this post will be a catalyst towards that.
And for christ's sake, why hasn't Disco Stu received his class rank yet?
Does DS dislike anyone new? He generally doesn't have a problem with transfers – although he thinks they should all stop congregating around the same tables at the entrance. And he didn’t like how during OCIP they took a lot of firm jobs away from fellow Boalties who were smart (or lucky) enough to get in the first time and have actually been going here a full year and a half – although he has no doubt they have a stronger work ethic than he does and will probably do better for a firm b/c they busted their ass at their previous (pathetic) law school in order to graduate with a Boalt JD.
Is DS jealous? He thinks on average 1Ls are a better-looking class. Perhaps a bit cooler too. There are some fun ones out there. Those who show up for bar review, or routinely get joked in Boalt Briefs and don’t complain about it. DS doesn’t think this is it though. He’s ready to be done with law school – after all, he’s phoning it in right now. DS certainly doesn’t wish he were a 1L, no matter how good they look.
Is DS just an asshole? (Remember though, he posted the 1L guide to OCIP and tried to pass down the lessons he and others had learned). Does this mean that he feels sorry for them in addition to loathing them?
Is DS just too old? Today’s music sucks. He generally doesn’t try to associate with anyone born in the 80s – though exceptions are made. To quote from Abe Simpson – “I used to be with it. Then what it was changed. And what I was with wasn’t it. And what was it was weird and scary.”
As a 3L will he dislike both 2Ls and 1Ls? Will he simply dislike the same rising 2Ls and not the new 1Ls?
As a 2L has DS not earned the right to think he’s better than 1Ls? As an upperclassmen in college he can’t remember disliking freshmen. He certainly thought they were less human, and treated them accordingly.
Is it the way they’re still interested in class? They answer all the prof’s questions. They still seem excited to be there. Does DS want to feel that way again?
Do all 2Ls feel like this (not just our class, but 2Ls in perpetuity)? Will this year’s 1Ls dislike next year’s 1Ls? Do other law school 2Ls dislike other law school 1Ls?
DS would be interested to see how other 2Ls feel toward our junior class. And how did last year’s 2Ls feel toward us?
A caveat. DS does not prescribe to Armen's notion that he will stand by everything he has written. DS is anonymous for a reason - this post. Transfers will get upset at this. 1Ls will get upset at this. DS is simply saying what many 2Ls are thinking. A frank discussion needs to be had about interclass dynamics and DS hopes this post will be a catalyst towards that.
And for christ's sake, why hasn't Disco Stu received his class rank yet?
Labels: 0L/1L Advice, Boalt Briefs, Grades And Other Neurotic Bullshit, Law School, Rankings And Associated Bullshit
posted by Disco Stu at 6:53 PM
28 Comments:
1Ls - Can't live with them; can't cage them only letting them for their bi-hourly beatings.
I think you're on to something. I'm a 3L, and I can't stand the 1Ls. As a 2L, I loved your class. You guys were fun. The 1Ls this year - they are not fun. They are lame.
I hate the 1Ls. What a bunch of gunners. I can't believe I have to sit in class and listen to these tools. They've ruined two of my classes this semester with their intellectual masturbation.
As a transfer who enjoys sitting around the entrance tables on occassion I must ask why does it bother you DS?
Not that I will stop sitting there or anything. I don't change for the world, the world just flows around me, but I am curious
I like DS's post tonight for its amazing honesty.
However, give the transfer students a break. As DS rightly points out, these folks dominated another institution. They didn't rest on their laurels. They fought inertia, they picked up their belongings and egos, uprooted their 1L roots, and now they're here. I hope the pastures here are indeed greener for them!
But, out of curiosity, are the transfer students dominating the rankings after one semester at Boalt? Do tell.
I do wonder if there's something particularly annoying about this 1L class. Perhaps, when Boalt moves up two spaces in the US News ranking, as we did last year (from 13 to 11), the school picks up a few more highly rank-conscious gal and guy gunners that otherwise would have gone to other schools and done their gunning there.
Hey 10:50pm, the 3L class applied to Boalt when we were #7. Ah, those were the days. Are they obnoxiously rank-conscious? I blame it on the fee hikes. The more expensive the school gets, the more it's becoming like every other law school in the country. Filled with gunners.
Yay transfers!
It would be much easier to know if the transfers were dominating the rankings if we actually knew what our rankings were. Dean Ortiz shouldn't have sent that email unless she had all the ranks in a spreadsheet ready to send out. As commented in a previous post, the delay isn't about the ranking itself, it's about a reputation for (in)efficiency.
The way I feel about 1Ls is similar to the way I feel about people (especially white people)-- individually: no problem; collectively: not a fan. Yet as I clench my teeth during the long-winded, look-at-me-I-did-the-reading, verbose musings of the 1Ls in some of my classes, I realize something horrible: that was me last year yapping and yapping when I should have kept my mouth shut. I used to want to break the awkward silence between an imploring professor and an indifferent class. Now I recognize it as an epic battle of wills. These 1Ls will learn.
Methinks DS will make a pretty good lawyer, but not a good exemplar of humanity.
I have to disagree with my esteemed 2L colleagues and state that I like the 1L's. Not all of them, but collectively I think they're all right. I think your disdain comes from your own self-loathing about the enthusiasm you've lost since coming here.
I also like the transfers--in many ways better than many of the 2L's who piss, moan, and rag on people who want to learn and do well. If the transfers top the rankings, power to them! If they're blocking the way at the entrance, that's your problem. DS can push them out of the way if DS has the balls to do it.
I wonder if attitude is the best proxy for ranking... I've tried to avoid the 2L Sturm und Drang and it's done me well. DO did get back to me with a rank yesterday, and though I won't clerk at the Supreme Court or anything, I know that my effort has produced something.
Not to take away from the stimulating 1L/transfer conversation (I hate both on the whole) but I got this today:
"You are ranked in the bottom 40% of the class after three semesters. This should in no way discourage you from applying for a clerkship. Each year Boalties from all levels of the rankings apply for and get great clerkships across the country."
Have others gotten ranges like this? I mean did they rank top 10%, 20%, 30%...bottom 40% etc.
Does my bottom 40% mean that I'm ranked anywhere between the (assuming 300 people) 180th and 300th person here? I mean, could I be last in the class? I've had some H's. A percentile rank would be much better. Instead of bottom 40 I should be 40th percentile - meaning that I'm ahead of 40% of the class but behind 60%. Information is no good if you can't tell what it means.
I always found 1Ls annoying, even when I was one.
I think a lot of it is the pressure of what the "law school experience" is supposed to be like: competitive, rigorous and full of people trying to bring you down. And that 1Ls are still operating under the false premise that they need to do the reading and go to class to graduate. It takes some time to get disillusioned, there is hope for them yet.
But until that day comes- haze them. Haze the living shit out of them. And then blog about it. A lot.
Good Times.
Re: Rankings. Here's another DO e-mail:
You are ranked in the top 10% of the class after three semesters.
Excellent work!!
I'm curious what grades 3:05 needed to get in the top 10%. A mixture of all Hs and HHs? Mostly HHs? What the hell is good in this school anymore?
Is posting one's class rank anonymously on a blog an appropriate use or is it an Honor Code violation?
Is 4:51 DO herself? Or maybe an underling?
As a 1L I'll admit that we have some real tools in our class. I doubt they'll shut up in the next 2 years. But I think at least 2/3 of our class is cool.
Honor code seems to say that you can't use your rank for other professional purposes, nothing about social (or anti-social) purposes. I'm not 3:05, but as another top 10% person, I can tell you that I have 5 HHs, 6 Hs, 1 P. I agree that a percentile rank would be way more helpful.
Talking about rank this way is NOT an honors code violation. The rules only prohibit, as the poster above wrote, revealing the information for professional purposes. First, no one is revealing their rank because this is all completely anonymous and should stay that way. There is no true revealing of rank. Second, as the poster above stated, this is for social and informational purposes, not professional purposes. We're just trying to figure out what the heck these numbers mean. The registrar and the dean have done a horrid job at explaining what's going on (the Boalt way), so thank goodness there's an area where we can piece the information together.
Hey, 7:20 PM, I don't get it. You took 12 courses? 5 courses last semester?
7:48--
I don't know how anonymous this forum is. Armen (jokingly) outed poster "Hordan Winkes" last week. If you post your rank, you may, at the very least, be disclosing it to Armen for him to do with it as he pleases.
Well the lesson to take away from that is to not write posts where your personality is glaringly obvious. I will make guesses as to who you are.
Also, If one has no personality like many of the 1L's this year, than one does not need to worry wbout losing one's anonymity.
I have a question. Where does one need to rank in order to be competitive for a clerkship?
Obviously, ranking isn't the only factor, but is there a percentage that you are generally "safe" at?
From a transfer student's perspective, I agree with all of the characterizations made thus far.
I will also add that since a year of law school provides a better measure of success/intelligence/charisma/attractiveness than an LSAT test, we do indeed think we're better than you.
So next time you see me or one of my fellow Mod-Ts congegating by the tables, know that in my heart I am thinking what SNL castmember Tracy Morgan once said to Lorne Michaels: "Git me a soda, bitch!"
P.S. Can you guess who I am?
12:22, I have a guess:
You're a dick.
And I think you meant 'congRegating.'
I don't know about the 1Ls, but I think the transfer students are both sexy and smart. Which makes them very much unlike the species known as "2L males"--of course, with some fine exceptions (emphasis on the FINE).
as a transfer, i too don't like the 1Ls and generally feel superior to them. there's just some je ne sais quoi about them that makes 1Ls in aggregate damn annoying.
also, for all the pretend "we don't care about grades at boalt" y'all are pretty damn gunnerish with all your concerns about rankings and transfers "stealing" jobs and things. don't put up this facade of p=jd and we're all so mellow when deep down many of you appear to have an incredible fixation with your grade status.
the transfers, that i know at least, are happy to be at boalt and content to take good classes, learn a lot and get whatever grades they get. None of us (that i know) are trying to blow out the curve. we've already shown we kick ass, now we're going to chill back and enjoy the ride.
the fact that we congregate at the tables in the lobby should just go to show we're relaxed and having fun, not locking ourselves in the library trying to ruin your chances at that uber clerkship.
finally, i could say that 2Ls in general could be a bit more kind to the transfers (especially when we first got to school). I've met a few cool 2Ls, but my general impression is that many of you go out of your ways a bit to be assholes to us or at least avoid having anything to do with us. maybe it's just intimidating to see so many smart confident people being themselves and having fun? We're pretty cool and we don't bite.
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